World Packaging Organization President Luciana Pellegrino

https://www.worldpackaging.org/

What an honor to get to interview the president of the World Packaging Organization Luciana Pellegrino 

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Welcome to the Sustainable Packaging Podcast with Cory Connors presented by Atlantic Packaging. I'm your host, Cory Connors. And today I'm thrilled to welcome Luciana Pellegrino. She is the president of the World Packaging Organization. And we had an amazing conversation about how the WPO is helping packaging companies and their brands improve their packaging and working with global organizations to make a positive impact. I'm truly excited to share this episode with you. Welcome Luciana. Thank you, Cory. It's so nice to join you and I'm so happy to take part of your podcast. Thank you for this opportunity. I'm honored to have you on. I've wanted to have you on for a long time since I saw you speak at the pack expo press conference several years ago. You're, doing amazing things in the world of packaging and sustainable packaging, but let's talk about, I know you have a very impressive background. I want to learn a little bit about that background. And then, what, what do you think prepared you best for this role as the president of the WPO? That's a very nice question, Cory, because it's an important message to companies as well. I started working at the packaging field when I was 21 years old or even 20 years old. So I started as a freshener. I didn't know anything about it. And I already started at the Brazilian Packaging Association, so as we call it, Abre, here in Brazil. What was so valuable about it is that I had the opportunity to grow on the road. So what I see, what is so important for professionals all around the world is that when they have the opportunity, when they have the opportunity to learn, when they have the opportunity to experience different experiences and to attend different conferences and play different roles. So that is what helped me to grow in the packaging industry. I had all the support from my organization to learn about the packaging industry, but more than that, to understand the entire ecosystems, what is valuable to this ecosystem. Attending meetings with governments, traveling around to train trade shows, interacting with different packaging magazines and journalists around the globe. So it is not only one path. but a multi, how can I say, a very rich experience that brought me to where I am. And at the same time, working for Aubrey, I had the opportunity to take part of WPO's board. And I took for 20 years before becoming the president of WPO. So it's a lifetime experience. I mean, it doesn't come so quickly. It requires time and for sure, a lot of focus and determination and resilience as well. But it is so amazing to work for such a dynamic industry. It's such a dynamic field. It's so related to our modern life in society. And there is plenty of room for the packaging industry to bring a positive impact to society. So that inspires me to move on and keep going. I love that. And I think our listeners need to hear that message one more time. If you're listening, there is huge opportunity and potential in the packaging field. And we just need to put in the work and do the job and you'll have incredible opportunities. And I had no idea you did 20 years on the board of the WPO. That's really impressive. So I have to read this because it's kind of long here. says, On your LinkedIn page, says the WPO, World Packaging Organization, is a global non-governmental organization with the mission, better quality of life through better packaging for more people. Can you tell us how you accomplish this mission at the WPO and maybe tell us a little bit more about what it is? So WPO is the global institutional body for the packaging industry and it has been playing this role for 58, almost 59 years now. So it's a very mature organization and WPO uh gathers as members packaging national bodies placed currently in 65 countries around the globe. So our goal is to represent and to support this industry on a global level, focusing on different aspects. So first of all, for sure, supporting and fostering encouraging packaging innovation. And we do that through the World Star Awards, that is this global competition, that every packaging that has won an award on a local level can apply for this global award offered by WPO. And that is very important for our community because it recognizes packaging technology, packaging advancements in material, in processing, in design, decoration, sustainability for sure. Also WPO has a huge focus on fostering packaging expertise and we do that through training programs. So we offer seven training programs on a local level. through WPO members. And so we send an instructor over there. We offer a three days program to share packaging knowledge, expertise in different fields and areas. But we also have been offering some online courses so that we can reach a broader audience. And then more than that, what has been a very important aspect of WPO's activities is partnering with different organizations to be able to bring and share packaging knowledge. So one very nice and fruitful case that we have is together with UNIDO, the United Nations branch focused on industrial development. And together with UNIDO, we support them on different countries, looking at the packaging industry on a local level and supporting to structure a packaging center if there is none, supporting a packaging testing facility. or even bringing packaging expertise. And then last but not least, WPO is also focused on fostering sustainability in different levels. So we have available at our website, that is worldpackaging.org, different brochures available for download. So for example, packaging design for recycling dies. that has been translated already into 15 languages. So you'll find it in Chinese, in Portuguese, Spanish, Czech, and many other languages. And it brings a very clear methodology on how to design packaging focusing on recyclability. And we know that recyclability is a very important aspect nowadays. But going beyond fostering sustainability also in different aspects and one of them is closely related to the climate issue. So how is packaging involved in this climate change challenge? And that goes through avoiding food loss and waste. So it's known that food degradation has a huge emission on methane gas that if it would be compared to countries and their emission on methane, would represent the third largest emission on the globe. So just after China and the US. So if food loss and waste is also harming and pushing the climate change, we understand that's packaging. We have to bring science, database, information and support with technical references. to bring better packaging solutions to supply chains, to food chains, to consumption chains, so that we can support to avoid losses. And then considering those three aspects, we as WPO aim to raise the voice for packaging, to be the body that is speaking on behalf of the packaging industry. If I can mention, Cory, very briefly, I mean, why this is so important for us and why this is also driving how I want to take WPO beyond as the president of WPO. Some years ago, I had the chance to visit the Expo Dubai. So together with Soha Tala, my colleague that stands as the vice president for marketing of WPO, we attended Expo Dubai and when visiting the sustainability pavilion that won was one of the most expected pavilions of the expo. What we realized is that they were talking about waste and packaging waste and only bringing very negative aspects on top of packaging. And there was no reference over there, bringing different perspectives, because for sure as society, we have a huge challenge to drive waste management, packaging, recyclability and the circularity. But also we have to consider how we are avoiding waste when we have packet goods being distributed all over the world, sourcing society and sourcing 8 billion people plus around the world and avoiding losses. So that is what we are focusing at WPO. Since that opportunity, we are raising the voice for packaging to bring also the positive impact of packaging sourcing society in a sustainable way, bringing sustainability to the consumption chains and for sure also driving packaging sustainability and circularity. Incredibly well said, Luciana. You're such an elegant speaker. enjoy listening to you and learning from you. This, is such a great point that food loss and food waste is the massive impact and there's nothing sustainable about rotten food. I mean, we are, we are absolutely focusing on some of the wrong things when we're looking at quote unquote, sustainable packaging. If it doesn't increase or improve the shelf life. of some of these products that need longer shelf life, it's not more sustainable. And you're exactly right. We need to look at this holistically and identify the packaging that can be... used in a shorter period of time. So some of these things don't need packaging that can last for two years. So we, there's a big challenge logistically for sure. I understand that. But why make it last for two years when it only needs to last for two weeks? So there's, there's certain uh ways of looking at that thing. And you mentioned your global uh abilities. I had no idea about the the awards that you could enter your awards if you have won uh a regional award or a national award. That's really impressive. When do you enter for those awards? Is that at the end of the year or any time? Yeah, no, no, we have a specific time for that. And it is, it goes on from August until end of September, middle of October. And we have the support of the local awards because as WPO, we cannot judge alone if that uh new technology, that new design approach, a sustainable solution is something new. in that country. It's something that stands out in that country. And that perspective, Cori, is so important because around the globe, you find different stages of maturity of the packaging industry. So in some countries, you have a high standard in terms of technology, also already the concept of sustainable packaging also embedded in every packaging. But in other countries, the stage of maturity is lower. So in developing economies, are getting, having more and more access to new technologies, to efficiency. So sometimes what can be new in one country, in one region, what could be a breakthrough in terms of packaging innovation in one region is not in another one. So we rely on the local awards to show us what has been a valuable innovation in that region. And then with that, they can apply through the worldstar.org website to the World Star Award that is judged by WPO members bringing this perspective from 65 different countries around the world. And then we have the award ceremony in the first half of the year. So usually around May, together with a large trade show. So the idea is that having the opportunity to have participants visiting that show, having access to the new technologies that are being offered there, but also attending the World Star ceremony. And not that, Cory, just also to add, it's so interesting as when you look at a packaging whenever you are traveling, that packaging can tell you so much about that society. I mean, if it's a rich society or not, how is the way of living? mean, how evolved is that society or even that country in terms of development, social development, economic development? So each packaging really translates the development of each country and culture. And we try also to look at that at the World Star Awards. I agree totally. enjoy going to grocery stores in other countries and learning about how they do things. And it's always so surprising and so interesting to see, you know, what it's like in Japan or France, or like you mentioned in Brazil, things are different everywhere and there's reasons for that. We had to delay this uh episode because of your efforts at uh recent United Nations climate change conference COP 30. Can you speak to that and what you and the team at WPO are doing to contribute or help with that? Yes, sure. So this was a part of our roadmap for, so as I mentioned, as president of WPO, I understood that we need to bring the packaging perspectives to strategic tables to place how we also support sustainable development in our society. So we, after that uh Expo Dubai, we attended the COP 28 that also took place in Dubai. and together with UNIDO and at that moment with the International Atomic Association. And then we started this roadmap on how we could build knowledge and references on how the food and loss really impacts the environment and impacts the climate and how packaging and especially sustainable packaging solutions can support to avoid and to address a more sustainable food chain. So together with Wageningen University, that is a research body based in the Netherlands, WPO, and that was led by Nerida Kelton, that is the vice president for sustainability for WPO. We started a research on food loss and waste and this paradox of the impact in the environment. And then what happened is that this year, alongside the World Circular Economy Forum, we were able to launch this position paper. So it was launched by UNIDO, by WPO and by Gannigan University, the three organizations together. And we made it public, these scientific references on the impact of food loss and waste. And now we are coming to COP 30, that was our milestone, to raise this perspective. on how as governments, as countries, we should have a very strategic agenda and counting with funds for sure, counting with researchers and all the efforts that are necessary to look at food chains on a local level and then uh understand the gaps and especially where is the loss occurring, where is the waste occurring. and then analyze through the packaging lenses on how we can bring more efficiency to that supply chain. And it's important to understand that when we talk about food loss and waste, we have a global perspective, a very broad perspective, but it must be addressed on a local level because in each country, according to its infrastructure, according to the local industry, uh according to local conditions, the losses may occur in a different stage of the supply chain. So giving an example on that, together with UNIDO, WPO has supported in Cambodia a specific industry that is the copfish industry that needed better packaging thinking, packaging design, supply chain design. So we collaborated on a project to look at the catfish segment in Cambodia and suggest solutions and new technologies, of course, according to the perspective that what they could afford in terms of technology. And we came up with a new system that reduces significantly the amount of losses in the catfish industry in Cambodia. So what we are doing now and together with from our participation at COP30 raising the matter of food loss and waste. We are working together with Wageningen University counting with the support of the FSSC Foundation on it too so that we can allowed a self analysis in each country, in each region, in each industry on where are the losses. and so that what could be the new solutions applied. incredible. It's such a big picture that you're looking at. And I think that's what it has to be to uh think big picture and then scale down to a specific project to show, look, if we do it this way, we can reduce waste, we can uh make the packaging more sustainable while, you know, eliminating or limiting the amount of food waste. That's very excellent. You've mentioned that college several times. Is that in Brazil or where is that located? You mean the cup? the college, the university. uh the Wageningen Research University is based in the Netherlands. Yeah, yeah. And, and... Yeah, so now we have a schedule to be together at COP together with FSSC as well on November 12th. So I hope that everyone can follow our participation at COP. and the discussion on this issue on food loss and waste. Where will that be this year? So this is very intriguing, because COP 30 will take place here in Brazil, and it's taking place in Belém. So it is in the Amazonia rainforest. So that is very interesting because it is an area that doesn't have a huge infrastructure. It's almost in the rainforest, so the infrastructure is not there yet. So there is some challenges for all the participants of COP to find accommodation and so on. But what the Brazilian government wanted by hosting the COP in the heart of the Amazonia rainforest is that for everyone to could experience how challenging it is to implement solutions or programs in the Amazonia, for example, to contain deforestation because it is a fact. Deforestation is taking place and we know for some years now. And it's very easy for someone to complain from outside saying why the Brazilian government is not, I mean, any action to contain deforestation. So the idea is to bring everyone to this region so that everyone can experience that it is a huge challenge. And perhaps Brazil cannot solve this alone, cannot fight this disparate, this for for a day, alone. So we do need global support on that because Amazonia has a huge impact in the global climate change. It's not only in our region, but for sure in our region, but it has an impact globally. What a great idea. And I totally agree with you that, Hey, look at, look at how difficult this is. Look at what we're dealing with. Come here and experience that. I think that's so, it's so easy to sit on the sideline and say, come on, play, play better guys. but what we need to do is get in the game and realize, Oh, this is actually very difficult. And there are significant challenges and I think that you're exactly right. It's a global challenge. It's a worldwide problem that is going to take a lot of effort. Go ahead. if I just can jump on that and add to your comment, the same happens when referring to packaging sustainability or sustainability in society, sustainability in the consumption chains. Because very often we hear to people just complaining about packaging in terms of waste generation and so on. But as you said, they don't look at the global picture. They don't look at the challenges that it's not referring only to packaging sustainability and producing and having technology to produce more sustainable packaging that we do already. I mean, there is so much technology in place, but there are other stakeholders involved in sustainability in our modern life in society. That should be the governments placing the message to consumers. not to litter and to disposal for recycling, a very clear message that here in Brazil, for example, we don't have that message. You may have it in Europe, you may have it in Japan, perhaps other countries as well, but in most of them, there is not a clear message. And there is no proper waste management and probably no recycling infrastructure there. Also, we need to engage consumers on how to dispose of recycling. how to separate a packaging. Sometimes you are cooking, you are busy, you are opening a can, opening a uh liquid carton, you are opening a jar. And then, my God, now I'm busy, I'm not, I mean, disposing this packaging for recycling now, but we should do it later. So there are other stakeholders that must work closely together so we can address waste management properly. We can address packaging recyclability and circularity properly. We can produce new packages using recycled material as well. And for sure with that, we can address greater sustainability in the consumption chain. After all, packaging is mostly serving the consumption chain. Yes. Well said. And exactly. We need to make it convenient, but we also need to encourage people to do the work to, to recycle or reduce their, their packaging uh usage. I did want to speak, uh, kind of quickly talk about the government insights, and, then stepping in with extended producer responsibility laws. How does, how do you feel and how does the WPO feel about these laws going into effect. The extended producer responsibility is expanding globally. What I see is that it's not always the same and the same measures in every country, but the concept is expanding globally. And that is very important because we do need to drive industries in terms of the packaging industry, in terms of the consumer goods industry as well. in terms of the retails as well, to one common direction on how we work together to drive sustainability in the consumption chain. But it's always, as I mentioned already, it's key to understand that even though we are talking about extended producer responsibility, governments have a key role to play because after all, waste management. recycling infrastructures, they go beyond the packaging industry itself, consumers engagement, they do rely on a clear message from governments. But we do see with good eyes because as I said, it's driving a new methodologies, new technologies in a more, how can I say, balanced way. Because when you don't have a clear regularmentation and then one company wants to make an effort and develop a new technology to bring a new sustainable solution. And that has a cost behind it. This effort sometimes may harm that brand's competitiveness because not always consumers will recognize the benefit of that new technology. But when it becomes a legislation that every company has to apply, every company has to make this investment, every company has to to bring more sustainability in such way, then it's fair. So in terms of competitiveness, because then every company is applying the same investment and they still can push a new step beyond in terms of a more sustainable consumption chain, but also being competitive in the market because at the end consumers are sensitive to costs and to price of products. And when when companies say sometimes we see, let me rephrase that sometimes we see that some researchers that say that consumers do pay more for sustainability. That can be applied, said perhaps in one country or another, especially countries where consumers have a higher budget, a higher power of consumption, but in developing nations where cost of living is so expensive. consumers cannot afford to pay more for one special sustainable solutions. They are always looking at cost effective solutions. For sure, I mean, when they desire something, they may pay a little bit more. But in a daily basis, for those products that are only sorting consumers for daily on top of daily needs like food or cosmetic household products, for example. they are looking at cost benefit. So what they expect from brands is that as a corporation, as a company that has this strength and technology and knowledge to provide the market with that product, to source the market with goods, consumer expects that those companies will bring sustainability already in the range of that product and not as something else. that they as consumers should pay for it. So it's a new demand from our society. Society is demanding the accountability, the responsibility from brands, from the supply chain, including the packaging one, that sustainability should be there in every product and not as something special that, okay, I can afford and I will pay for this. Yeah, exactly. And I love your point about extended producer responsibility, leveling that playing field for all companies and consumers basically demanding that, hey, we need it sustainability as a leading force here in this world because uh we see the effects of it negatively if we don't. So great. This has been so great, Luciana. Thank you again for being on. I truly appreciate you and what you're doing at the WPO. Any final words for the audience? Yes, well, please count on WPO at all social media and our website also with all the national packaging bodies across the globe to leverage the discussion on packaging and to have more references to build more references and to you Cory also Congratulations to all the work you are doing is spreading the message is spreading the news. You are also a very important part of our industry. Thank you so much. Thank you.