Why is paper a sustainable material? Metsa Board (Kristen Clark)

https://www.metsagroup.com/metsaboard/

Is paper more sustainable than other packaging materials? 

Thank you again kristen.clark@metsagroup.com 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/cory-connors/

I'm here to help you make your packaging more sustainable! Reach out today and I'll get back to you asap.

This podcast is an independent production and the podcast production is an original work of the author. All rights of ownership and reproduction are retained—copyright 2022.

Transcript

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Welcome to Sustainable Packaging with Cory Connors. Today's guest is my friend Kristen Clark, the communications manager at Met Board. How are you, Kristen? Doing well. How are you? Good. I'm a big fan of your company. I've, had one of your coworkers, Nate, on before. and, but I'm excited to talk about you and what you do at the company and why it's such a sustainable material. And, but let's start first before we get into your business. Let's talk about you. How did you get into this, role that you're in? I, fell into it by accident, much like many happy things that happened. prior to working at Met Board, I spent 15 years working in consumer packaged goods marketing. So completely different animal than, than working with Paperboard. Yeah. but it's been a good change and I've been working with Met Board for just over four years now. That's great, although that relates a lot to what you're doing now. I like that. because what you're doing now is the precursor to the CPG group, packaging, so that makes sense. Exactly. it's been really interesting because I was the one going to procurement being like, I need a package for this. What can you do? And now I'm on the other side of it. So it's come full circle. I, I did the same. I started out in production and so I think I love having that background, because you get to know. Why maybe it's so difficult to run a thing a certain way or why maybe it takes two weeks or why does the tooling cost $5,000? Right. Because you've seen it, you've actually put it on the machine. you've tried it out, but no, great point. Yeah. So what is the, met a group? I think it's, it's important that we start or met a board, I should say. What is MET Board? we'll start with Metsa Group because it falls under Metsa board, but Metsa group is a. Forest Cooperative. So we are owned by, our 90,000 Finnish forest owners. and Metsa group contains five different business areas, so forest services. So they help, the finished forest owners get the most out of the forests that they own, tissue, for grease proof papers and parchment papers and things. Of cooking nature. pulp, self-explanatory wood, which does, construction materials board, which is where I work, and we do have an innovation arm of the company called Mesta Springs. So they get to work on all sorts of fun, up and coming, innovation things. That's wonderful. Yeah. and it's not finished. It's Finnish. Finnish , right? Yes. So we're talking about. in Finland, the country? Yes, in Finland. I had that mistake when I talked to Nate last time, I was, wait, what are you saying? Oh, Finland. Oh, I see what I didn't notice. Didn't many pictures. I, yeah, I didn't notice when I watched, so it was okay. Yeah, that was good. He's, he's a great guy and you're doing great things there with him. 90,000 people, managing a sustainable forest is, or forests. I should say is wonderful and it's exciting. Yes. I think the packaging industry is grateful to have you and your team. But why is, paper such a sustainable option for packaging? I think particularly Metsa aboard papers. we as a company and as a cooperative, really take sustainability to heart. It's involved in everything that we do from the forest out to the packaging out on the shelf. But, I could talk for hours on it, but I'll try to keep it a little shorter. so first of all, at Metsa we try to use the entire tree to make sure nothing goes to waste. We don't wanna waste a thing. as mentioned, the most valuable parts of the tree, the trunks are used for the construction wood products for our wood business. And the thinner parts of the tree. the larger, branches and whatnot are used for our pulp and paperboard businesses. And then any leftover bark or smaller branches or anything that isn't used in any of those other processes are used to, generate bio, energy for our plants. So we really try to use every single less little less thing so that we're not wasting. and not only that, I'm not sure if this is well known or not, but when. Metsa board takes a tree down, between four and seven trees are then planted to take its place. so we're ensuring a steady supply that the forests will never, be depleted. That's awesome. Wow, that's so cool. I'd love to hear that. It's, also our manufacturing processes allow for our paper boards to be lighter in weight, but still strong enough for, for our customers and uses. So that helps lower the carbon footprint of our products. And the manufacturing process also generates sidestream again with. The idea of minimizing waste, they generate side streams that are valuable, wrong materials, not only for us and our other businesses, but for some other applications. one good example for is we partner with a company in Finland, that uses some of our sidestream as animal bedding. So farm animal bedding, cows and horses and pigs and things of that nature. And then after it is used as animal bedding as in the stalls or cleaned out, they then use it out in the agricultural fields as a method of soil improvement. So we're really trying to get the most out of. Everything, that we use or any of our side streams. And then That's awesome. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. It's truly circular. It's truly circular and it's exciting to see. It is, it really is that, you think something can't be used again and someone comes up with a new way to use something that you can't, and it just continues on the process, which is really great to see. and then last but not least, Mets board and Met group, but I'm more familiar with Metsa boards goals. we have really, ambitious sustainability goals. So by 2030 we are aiming to have completely fossil free, mills and products. and we are 89% of the way there. As of the close of 2024, we were using 89% fossil free energy. So we're well on our way to meeting that goal, which is excellent. Yeah. Congratulations. Thank you. It's, they put a lot of work into it and a lot of effort and so it's nice to see that we're making great progress. at the same time, another one of our goals is to reduce our process water usage, per product ton by about 35%. So really trying to, Take a look at where we can, maximize, things and utilize less in other areas. again, really strong sustainability goals. And there's, as I mentioned, probably about a hundred other things I could mention, but we only have a short amount of time together, so I'll cut it there, I appreciate that and it's important to understand that. that the process for making paper recirculates water, which is really great and, for your processes, I think that's, really important to, to notice. And to talk about, because, a lot of times the pushback on paper is that, oh, it uses so much water. yes, but it's used efficiently and it's, I think you're working really hard to use it even more efficiently. Right. Exactly. That's the goal. Yeah. And nobody wants the forest to be more sustainable than the farmers that, that, that profit from it. Right, right. And they don't, they want it. So it's, this, I started my career at Weyerhaeuser, so a similar company where we made. Boxes and we owned forest land and had friends that in the northwest that were pushed back on me and say, you're cutting down trees. yeah, but we're also planting millions of trees and we're also, we care about, so I think what you're talking about for meza is the same mentality. Exactly. There's so much that people don't know. you could write. books and books and pages on it, yeah. it's incredible what you're doing. I'd like to shift the focus here to packaging. Sure. there's been a big thing in the packaging industry called the paper of packaging. Yes. Which I know you support, but I would like to say, I look like to know your thoughts on any maybe mistakes that you've seen so other people can avoid that. I wouldn't quite say mistakes. I'll call them missteps. yeah. But I think, and it's rather broad, but I think the biggest misstep is that a lot of companies and brands really aren't embracing paperboard as a plastic replacement alternative. we, and it's a shame because paperboard is. Excellent. And it has many characteristics that, would be great as a plastic replacement. and we have our packaging design here in the US and we have one over in Finland as well. we work together and we schedule what we call them workshops, with many brands. So anybody who wants to interact with us, anything, what can you help me do with this package? I want to reduce plastic or I wanna reduce my carbon footprint or whatever. whatever their end goal is, we can work together with them, to make something work for them. I didn't know that. I didn't know that you had design capabilities. That's exciting to learn. It is, yeah. We have, we have two full design teams, one in Finland and again, one here in the us So depending on your time zone, we could make something work and, they work together as well. So it's not like they're separate entities. They are in constant contact and they bounce ideas off of one another. So it's a great, opportunity to utilize, different point of view and get some new perspectives on what your packaging could be. That's great. Where in the US are they? We, our office is located in Norwalk, so we have, some of the design team located, centrally in headquarters. And then we have another one who works remotely out of Maryland. on the East coast. But, That's great. Yeah. that's a, that's an excellent service and an unexpected service from a supplier of the raw material. That's, really cool to hear that. Yeah, it is, it's great. I think it's, as you mentioned, it's a great service and, it's all because we want. To see more sustainable options out there, and we want to see the plastic replacement that's not happening. And by utilizing our team, it's a great opportunity to see what we can do together with you. yeah. And collaborate with packaging companies like Atlantic and Right. this, there's so many people that can help. oftentimes people come to me frustrated, oh, I don't know how to start. And I, and there's so many people who are willing to help and, to lift you up out of the frustration zone. Absolutely. You just need to ask. You just gotta ask. That's it. Exactly. let's talk about extended producer responsibility laws. I think this is something that's right in the forefront of a, of everyone's minds in the packaging industry because Oregon is already, charging those fees and there's, seven or eight states coming online soon and even more in the works. Yes. But I'd like to see, have those affected sales of paper, and if so, if not yet, do you think it will? it's hard to say right now. yeah, but I think as you mentioned, as more and more states are coming online with these similar policies, I'm sure the effects will be felt soon. The positive effects, I will say. Yeah. That's good. And it's exciting that it will improve recycling eventually, of paper. So you'll get your numbers up even higher, I think, which will be good. Yeah, I hope so. And for everything, not just paper, but for all materials, that's the goal, at least. according to the people that are pushing for this EPR laws. So what, I think there's a lot of misnomers. We talked about some of these things in managing forests. What should consumers know about it? is there maybe something like a quick few things that you could tell us about it? Oh, again, this is another one that you could write books on, but I think the most important one, if I had to pick one or two, the most important one would be that paper when sourced responsibly is probably one of the most sustainable materials that we can use. and you mentioned earlier that it, it's a little bit of a misnomer, but, when done responsibly, it is probably one of the most sustainable forests. again, at Met Board, we're planting more trees than we use, And, I think the second most important thing is that modern point paperboard reduction is far more energy efficient and more often than not, powered by renewable energy. So it's much more, Sustainable than people would believe it is. Yeah. That really reduces the carbon footprint. I know. with the lifecycle analysis, you need to look at the energy used, to produce the product. And I think so your efforts there have been, will pay off in spades I think. I hope so. I hope so. I wanna see good things happen, yeah. And I know that, Nate was talking about, how not always using recycled material is a better option. so sometimes virgin papers or packaging materials can be even more sustainable. Can you talk us through that kind of mindset? Sure. I think at met board, we don't discount anybody, whether it's virgin or recycled, paper boards. everything has a fit for purpose, right. and recycled boards will sometimes be better than, Virgin. Fiber paper boards In some instances, right? I think it's important to know that you, you do need both. it's gonna be a balance, right? You can't depend solely on recyclable, because at some point those recycled fibers are gonna become too weak and short too. to meet your, strength requirements for whatever packaging it is. So you need that fresh influx of virgin fibers to help keep that recycling loop going. So again, it's a balance and you have, you need both in order to succeed, no matter which, paperboard it is you're using. Yeah, well said. And I think that's one of the common things in packaging is it depends, and it depends on what you're doing. And if you have space for thicker material, maybe recycled or higher recycled content is the smart move. But like you said, the MEA material is known for being strong and clean and pure. And I think that's, what you've done there is one of the top quality products in the industry. thank you. Yeah, we like to say so ourselves, but it's nice to hear it from others. Yeah. let's talk about, how people can get in touch with you. is it, email? Is it a website? What do you recommend? Yeah, so the easiest of you would like to get in contact directly with me. Email is probably the easiest because I can get to it no matter where it is I am. and that is Kristen K-R-I-S-T-E-N, dot Clark, C-L-A-R-K, at mets group.com. Or you can feel free to reach out to us on LinkedIn at our Mets A Board Americas page at Mets a Board Americas. And, if you're looking to get in touch with sales, you can contact me and I'll direct you to the appropriate sales representative. That's great. I'll include those, links in the notes. So if you're listening, just scroll up and, you can click on those. what about any events coming up soon? I know you, you often go to large packaging events or even small. Yes, we do. we are, we try to hit all of the major packaging, shows that we can, when we can. but our next big one will be in Pac Expo Las Vegas, in late September. And our booth number for those of you that will be there is SL 19 0 14. And then after that, the next big show we have will be Core Expo, in Savannah in later in October. Oh, I haven't heard of that one. Is that corrugated? That's a corrugated conference, yes. Oh, interesting. Core expo. there's so many shows and I'm there is, I know you do a good job of choosing the right ones to go to, so I'm impressed by that. Oh, thank you. Yeah. and outside of those, we do try to hit all of the, again, when we can and, resources allow personnel resources allow. We do hit all of the major sustainability, conferences as well. So you've probably seen us there Excellent. thank you Kristen. This has been great. keep up the good work and we'll see you soon. Thank you. You keep it up too. Thank you.