Sustainable Packaging
Industry Experts discuss all the new materials and ways that packaging can be more sustainable and how we can do our parts to help recycle and reuse. Sustainable Packaging is and will continue to affect us all in our daily lives. We have lots of fun and get down to the real data of what's working to help our planet!
Sustainable Packaging
US Plastics Pact Winner (Life Made Products) Josh Russo & Scott Dyvig
https://usplasticspact.org/
What if we could replace Styrofoam with a compostable option?
How did winning the US Plastics Pact help Bioffex?
What's the future for cold chain packaging?
https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottdyvig/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshuarusso/
Check out our sponsor Orora Packaging Solutions
https://ororapackagingsolutions.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/cory-connors/
I'm here to help you make your packaging more sustainable! Reach out today and I'll get back to you asap.
This podcast is an independent production and the podcast production is an original work of the author. All rights of ownership and reproduction are retained—copyright 2022.
Welcome to Sustainable Packaging with Cory Connors. Today's guests are winners of the U. S. Plastics Pact award this year from LifeMade Products. We've got Josh and Scott. Scott, let's start with you. Will you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about your background?
Scott Dyvig:Sure. No, pleasure to be here. Thanks, Corey. so my name is Scott Dyvig. I'm senior director of business development here at LifeMade Products. I've been here about 10 years of helping on the engineering and business development side. And my background is really About 20 years in cold chain and protective packaging. So Josh and I actually started together back. 20 years ago in the early 2000s, at Thermo safe when we were doing, coaching packaging in the lab there in Phoenix. And since then, I've moved on, I was with Sears for a while doing a protective packaging for Kenmore and craftsman products, which was an interesting, a diversion there and then came to life phone when they were looking for help with setting up a new lab, a new certified lab out in, in the bell camp area. and worked on setting up thermal modeling and setting up a lot of the engineering before transitioning over to the business development side, where I am now.
Cory Connors:Excellent cold chains. Not easy. I know that. And, we need experts like you both to be successful there, especially with the sustainable alternative. Josh, how about you, sir?
Josh Russo:Yeah, thanks, Corey. Thanks for having us. look, I'm the, innovation manager for, for life made. did I say my last name? It's Russo. like Scott said, we both got started in thermal protective packaging in the early 2000s. I took a little bit different detour from Scott. getting into some project and program management, getting my PMP and working in data transport product development for a few years before I got the call from Scott at LifeMade asking if I wanted to get back into cold chain packaging. and I'm now here and responsible for new product engineering, at LifeMade. funny, Scott's, Scott, between us, Scott's the actual engineer, I'm a liberal arts guy who likes tech talk. So we are,
Cory Connors:I love it. Thank you, sir. This is great. You both have, perfect backgrounds for what you're doing now. And it makes sense that you're innovating in this side of things and, but let's talk a little bit about what is biofax and how can it replace, expanded polystyrene packaging.
Scott Dyvig:Sure, yeah, and it helps to give a little bit of history. Life Foam has been molding EPS since the late 50s. It actually started as, lifelike products. We were molding tunnels for toy train sets. so really one of the first to do molded EPS. And in the early 1960s started into picnic coolers and, have since then in the, 80s, 90s moved into, pharmaceuticals. And as that became more prevalent with cold chain packaging. really been molding these insulated containers for 50, 60 years now, with a long history of it. And then at some point the team started to say, what's the next thing? How can we replace EPS one day? What can we start working on? in early 2010s, They started saying, what are the different materials that could be used to replace CPS and started molding different items. That's really whereby effects began. it's taking quite a long time to develop and commercialize because it's such a complex technology. But in the end, we're experts in molding and we have locations across the US. We've been doing it a long time. Finding a sustainable solution to EPS that utilize that expertise, utilize that equipment, utilized all of those, molds and the way we develop sustainable packaging, was really the right fit for us to try to find this sustainable alternative. and so we've basically launched it with, in high volume with, with, pharmaceutical companies and find that it fits a good mix of replacing EPS, but still having that. Comfort of what a lot of the things EPS can provide in today's, today's transports.
Cory Connors:Excellent. congratulations on finding a new solution. That's a huge deal. Can you, Josh, can you tell us about it? what does it mean? yeah.
Josh Russo:I want to give you some of the technical background too.'cause Yeah, bioffex is, it's an expanded polylactic acid polymer, right? So it's coming from, PLA, it's that, bio-based. uh, feedstock, right? That's coming in there. And what our team at Lifemade has figured out how to do is make the foamed beads. And then how to mold those beads on existing EPS molds, right? Modified, of course, but the bones of the presses are the same. so it molds on these familiar presses. but it's not. It's not that we're just pumping Biofex beads into the old Hirsch and popping out compostable containers. I like to, go Han Solo with it and say, we made a lot of special modifications, on these, presses and, the molding controls of this process are as much a part of the, the secret sauce of Biofex as the bead making process, itself. So in the end, you get these foam beads. And you're making them and it's amazing. One of the amazing things about it, and this is part of what, when Scott called me to say, come work at life made, he told me about biofeds and it hadn't even launched yet. And I got so excited about this idea of maybe cleaning up the pacific garbage patch one more time. And that being the end of it, that was the picture I had in my head. and there is so much surface area in this phone. Corey, I'm sure you can imagine, right? You got microscopic beads of carbon dioxide is what's used for the foaming agent. And man, the bacteria love that. And when we put it in a compost pile, we've done what we have access to, in total probably jumping ahead on myself here, but it's very exciting material. and, that's a little bit of the technical background.
Cory Connors:and congratulations on the U. S. Plastics Pact win this year, one of four winners this year. Can you talk us through that process? How did you enter? How did you win? What was the experience like at Circularity24 receiving that award?
Josh Russo:Yeah. Oh, thanks. First of all, really appreciate that. Bioffex is a really exciting material, and we're proud of the work and the development that went into developing, and we're gratified that it's being recognized. Frankly, we need to acknowledge Sam Bhargava, as the inventor. And, there's a very skilled and dedicated team of engineers who help bring biofex to the market. But, Sam's on a new adventure right now. And we'd be remiss if we didn't mention him as, as the inventor of biofex. that's really important.
Cory Connors:So the material is compostable, is that right? Yeah. Yeah. Industrially compostable. Industrially
Josh Russo:compostable. That's right. And, yeah, like I said,
Cory Connors:go ahead. Yeah. Four, four weeks of, time in the pile and it's gone forever.
Josh Russo:That's right. So we know that we got four weeks, in A-S-T-M-D 6,400, in, we're also partnered with, with CMA, right now. And actually, we've completed three outta three. now, we got results on, covered in vessel. windrow and, what's the third one? Aerated static pile. So it's just in the last two weeks that we got those results back for field testing, which is what the compost manufacturers Alliance, sorry, I'm throwing, acronyms at you.
Cory Connors:I was about to ask what does CMA stand for? So thank you. Yeah,
Josh Russo:no problem. they've got a set of tests and they say, first you got to pass the D 6, 400, which is the standard. Test for bioplastic. Items right? A. S. T. M. Consensus standard. They say if you can pass that, and we know, part of a part of 6400 is also demonstrating aside from the disintegration part where the product goes away, also proving. in a lab that biodegradation is the mechanism of disintegration and also that there aren't any harmful chemicals being left behind. there's some product characterization, FTIR analysis to make sure there's no heavy metals or PFAS. And then, the other piece that's really interesting is that they check for biotoxicity. So they actually germinate plants In the compost medium after the testing is complete in D6400 and, your product can't have a negative effect, or whatever is left behind in the soil of your product, those kind of leave behinds of, composting, can't negatively impact plant growth. So it's pretty neat what they do.
Cory Connors:It's incredible. I, I know that there has been some hiccups in composting and compostable packaging. we're hoping that continues to improve. Are you seeing improvements there in, in the national trend towards more compostable accessibility for packaging?
Josh Russo:Yeah, I think we are. Um, the thing that most encourages me, I'm part of, or I'm meeting with the group. every month right now to talk through some of these infrastructure problems. It's partly sponsored by CMA. what they're doing is they're taking all of the different members of the value chain, and just having roundtables and talking about this is what matters to us. Right? Because, frankly, biofex looks a lot like EPS right now, and, to be able to say, we're going to have a, we have to have a conversation with a composter, Corey, to have them say, this is not contamination. how do we make that transition? And what we're finding is that they're very open. To those conversations. It's really, it's really been encouraging because you read headlines and you say, I've seen composter's right, articles or op eds in the local paper that says, No, we don't want your compostable cup, right? That was a few years back. I think that the I think that the attitude is changing now where we're saying, all right, this is an opportunity. And if we work together, if we can be transparent, that's the problem, right? What composters don't want, but sorry, let me take a quick digression. Here's what I learned getting into compostable products. Compost is not waste. Compost is a value chain. All right. I had not I had to have my mind open to that reality, but they've got to be able to produce saleable compost. They need to make compost that people want. Otherwise, it's there's no point in it. It might as well be a landfill. So this these kind of partnerships have been, really educational for us and really encouraging as we're trying to say we've got we think a world changing product. but What difference does it make if we, if it's all going to go to a landfill, we gotta be able to partner with these folks and find ways, whether it's source separation or whatever, to get those products safely into a compost pile.
Cory Connors:Yeah, said. And how do you identify it so that a consumer and then the, the composting companies understand that this is compostable? Is it a colorant that you add? Is it marking on in the mold? what's the story there?
Josh Russo:Yeah, go ahead. Scott.
Scott Dyvig:Yeah, I think marking is the 1st method. that can identify it with special indents to show that it's a different material. I think eventually color might help enforce that even more. the end of life, and as Josh has talked about, the composting is a challenge for a lot of materials. ultimately it's a hundred percent USDA bio preferred. It's coming from all good materials. It's not using any petroleum incoming, materials, of course, without the petroleum uses a lot less water in the manufacturing. It was uses a lot less, greenhouse gases as it's using the CO2 versus the pentane. even as a, like, for, like, going into the manufacturing process, a lot of those benefits are already banked in the. In the product and end of life, it's going to go where it goes. And if it's, it'll go back to being good material, if it's in a condition that will allow that. And it won't, if it's in a condition that won't allow that, if it does break down, it'll be into good materials being, based on PLA. It doesn't break down into microplastics. So the ability to have some of those benefits, the reduced water, the reduced, petroleum, the reduced greenhouse gas is all built in by the time it gets used. Is a lot easier to quantify and take advantage of and make claims around for companies because it's not based on the end users, what they do with it, which is very difficult to control anyways. And we see debates around recycling materials. What can be recycled? What can't be recycled? It's not like that's an easier path necessarily. They're all a bit complicated. And that's what a lot of your work is doing is to helping that, shed some light on that. And at least in bioffects, when it compared to EPS, and you look at the LCA, and you look at everything, doing the same job, not reducing or increasing damage rates, which is a bad sustainability path to go down to. not causing medicine to go out of temperature. All of that with the sustainability savings means that yes, at the end, if it goes to a compostable, facility, that's great, that's the ultimate goal. and that's completes that full circularity. But even if it doesn't, it's done a great job to, do better for the environment than an EPS would have in that position.
Cory Connors:That's a great point. Packaging must perform, right? We always talk about that. It has to do its job, has to get the product there safely, at the right temperature, undamaged, to the consumer, or to the, B2B situation, whatever we're shipping. What is the most common use for biofex? is it cold chain? Is it, is it cushioning? what's, is it all of the above?
Scott Dyvig:It definitely has applications of all the above. I think cold chain, has a certain, set of requirements to it that make it difficult for other materials to necessarily replace as easily. in cushioning, for example, when I was at Sears, you would have a stack of refrigerators that were 500 each, stacked 26 feet tall. You wouldn't necessarily want a molded pulp base in the summer in Atlanta to be the thing holding that stack up. If you've ever been in a warehouse when a stack of refrigerators falls over. it's something else to experience. there's things with appliances and the weight and the cushioning and the vibration and the motors that you, you definitely want something that acts a lot like EPS. in order to replace, and I think that's 1 of the challenges of that industry is just stack heights, the weight, the distance it's traveling and then just how it's handled. if you buy a 5, 000, 4, 000 refrigerator with a beautiful front. You don't necessarily want scratches and dings and dents and plastics. And so there's a definite, field in, in appliances. They don't necessarily see another cushioning opportunities, but cold chain, the value of the products just tends to be so high. You can have a 10, 000 drug going to a specialty farms, especially pharmacy to someone's house that just makes the combination of. Sustainability as a desire for ESG goals or for, to get customers, happy with the product. Ultimately that area it's, it can be difficult for customers to replace EPS because customers who receive it, patients who receive the medication, they prioritize the safety of that medication over the sustainability of that delivery system. And You want to replace it with something and that's where biofix has been helpful is that it does look a lot like EPS. It makes patients feel comfortable when they receive it. They don't question a lot of things. like if you ever received maybe, a meal kit or, or, frozen meat to your house and it's not exactly as cold as you'd like it. You, you may have a complaint. You may have some questions, if it's something that you're going to inject into your own self, for medication, it just takes it to a whole nother level. And EPS has done such a great job over the last decades. The amount of material that it's moved safely is amazing. and it's made it difficult to replace because it's been such a commoditized industry. the infrastructure of manufacturing it is very well established, and the establishment isn't quite as there yet. and end of life isn't quite as there yet, but the, the ability for the pharmaceutical industry with FDA regulations to be able to validate it. The consistency of a pack out in cold chain is harder to do with flexible liners that you assemble yourselves. You're not hiring packaging engineers to assemble these every morning at your facility. The ability for something to be molded and come the same every single time, makes quality departments much more comfortable than something that's flexible or different, or has a different weight every time. and so where EPS can protect physically with strength in the small parcel system, where it can protect thermally with good R value. and where it's a cost effective solution, BioFX can do all of that. keep it safe, keep it structurally secure, keep the same R value, keep the same performance. but also have that sustainability story that can help with a lot of the ESG goals that we see customers have. That's
Cory Connors:awesome. That's good news, really. we just, I live in Oregon. We just banned polystyrene food containers and, and anything with PFOS as far as food packaging goes. Will you create a line of to go containers so that you can keep that thermal properties and be successful there?
Josh Russo:Yeah, I gotta say something before, before I take that one on Corey, which is that, the bands thing just brings to mind, you mentioned that, right? We spend way more time than we want to, looking into monitoring, getting legal advice on, developing legislation, right? And partly to Scott's point, part of what we see is, That most of the time, pharmaceutical packaging is grandfathered, right? Even when these, when, if an EPS band comes into place, they say, Oh, but not for medical shipments, right? That's usually included in the law. And so I think that speaks partly to, what Scott's saying about the performance of EPS and the need for that, that sense of, cleanliness and predictability and consistency, that we've been able to capture with bio effects. in our, our main challenge is like Scott said that value stream doesn't have the kind of scale that EPS has yet. yeah, we're certainly open to the idea of other applications, including food. we're exploring technology, in terms of where we're developing around bead sizes and things like that. what kinds of post processing we can do, on the and so forth. So yeah, we'd love to have a, a biofex clamshell. and I think that would be a powerful product. I think we're a couple of years out, but, certainly exploring those ideas for sure.
Cory Connors:Very exciting. And, like you said, as composting becomes easier and more readily available, hopefully curbside to, most of the people in the world someday, that would be very effective. Anything else you guys wanted to talk about before we, close this out?
Josh Russo:um, I just wanted to say, like, I've touched on it a little bit, but one of our messages is that we engineered bio effects. For the compost infrastructure that we want, not the compost infrastructure that we have. Right. And that's just I've made that kind of a catchphrase for me, but it's so important. And, We're brainstorming currently ideas. around retail and institutional partnerships, right? if we make a protective packaging piece, can a big box store collect that for us? A lot of them are collecting EPS already, can they add a green bin there? those ideas are in the brainstorming phase. But, I, one of the things that is very important to us is, just thinking about, It's thinking about the full life cycle. I think we've got that 100 percent bio based beginning of life, but we are, we're not content to say, it's compostable, your problem, once, once consumers or users are done with it. we're trying to explore those areas and advocating in those areas. as well. and I'll say one other thing, just that this is a this is important for life made across the board, right? we're reducing CO2 by eliminating plastic windows. We have a whole retail division, that's making consumer, packaged goods, right? Including Disposable cutlery and things like that. So we're eliminating plastic windows to reduce CO2 there. We're developing compostable cutlery, in one of our, one of our sister divisions, where they do precision injection and blow molding. you got a, bottle cap that's on the shelf now that reduced that plastic material. 25 percent without any loss in performance. So it's across the board. And, one of our big messages is that we don't think there's a silver bullet. We don't, we think BioFix is great. BioFix is great. BioFix is not going to solve the climate, right? Not by itself. We need everything. We do need more recycling. and there may be applications where EPS can never go away, but we ought to be recycling it. so that's just, that's my parting shot,
Cory Connors:Yeah, said. The future is bright for sustainable packaging. I truly believe that. We've got so many things in the works, that will make positive changes, and are making positive changes. So it's very exciting. Scott, what's the best way for people to get in touch with you and the team over there?
Scott Dyvig:Yeah, absolutely. both Josh and I are LinkedIn, obviously welcome to connect with us there. we're at, I'm at scott. diavig at lifemadeproducts. com. And you can always visit biofacts. com or lifemadeproducts. com. And, as Josh mentioned, we still have a lot of things coming up in the future. on LinkedIn, we post all of those. but it is a commercial product. It's out there in high volume. and feel free to reach out. It's available, today. We're not waiting on anything.
Cory Connors:Thank you both for your wisdom. I really appreciate it.
Josh Russo:Thanks for having us, Corey. really great conversation. Thank you, Corey.
