Google Packaging Innovation with Miguel Arevalo

https://www.linkedin.com/in/arevamgu/

What is Google doing to package their products more sustainably? 
Can packaging be circular? 
How to minimize packaging and still protect the product. 

Miguel Arevalo is a packaging innovation lead to Google and we get to discuss the amazing things they are doing. 

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/packaging-today-show/id1656906367

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Packaging Today Podcast 

https://open.spotify.com/show/6dksVwqEFVDWdggd27fyFF?si=e924995740f94e19

https://www.linkedin.com/in/cory-connors/

I'm here to help you make your packaging more sustainable! Reach out today and I'll get back to you asap.

This podcast is an independent production and the podcast production is an original work of the author. All rights of ownership and reproduction are retained—copyright 2022.

Transcript

Cory Connors: 0:15

Welcome to Sustainable Packaging with Cory Connors. Today's guest is Mr. Miguel Arevalo. He is the Packaging Innovation Lead at Google. A little company, right? We've all heard of. Wow. Great to have you on, sir. Thank you so much.

Miguel Arevalo: 0:29

Corey, thank you for having me. It is a pleasure to be here. I believe this forum is so important to maintain close communication among us packaging professionals and receive the latest and greatest information. I follow you and thank you and kudos for you, sir. Awesome.

Cory Connors: 0:43

Thank you. Thank you so much. It was an honor to meet you and a couple of your associates at Green Biz, their event in Seattle, Circularity 23, which was amazing. but first let's talk about you. Let's talk about your background a little bit. How did you get into, packaging?

Miguel Arevalo: 1:00

Currently, right now, I am the Innovation. In fact, innovation leave, you know, we're at Google. No. So you oversee overall emerging technologies to help us drive competitive advantage in that to be true new technology. Usually this is mainly driven, of course, by sustainability. Sustainability is core within the innovation process and right now is one of the pillars on how we do things. But of course also we, we consider accessibility in packaging, which I can be able to talk a little bit more on that. And digital solutions. So we can be able to put, education and learning opportunity also for consumers, so they know exactly what to do with our boxes. Google has many products and services. Maybe one thing that I would like to highlight to your audience is of course, Google. We know about the search. We know some of us about the cloud system and whatever, it's specifically what our team does. It's a, the fun part of the toys itself. No, the hardware portion of it, right? We have pixel phones. We have our home devices, Fitbit also, as trackers and smart watches and also earbuds. So everything. So we can be able to try to embrace an ambient computing where we can leverage hardware. The powerful capabilities of software that Google has along with AI and machine learning on it so we can provide a thoughtful experience for consumers. Our team owns both the structure in graphics and our main vision is we want to enable. A thoughtful, equal, and sustainable unboxing experience for everyone. Before my journey here, I was on Procter Gamble. I had the opportunity there to learn from the best across 10 years, specifically within the Blade and Razors business unit. So brands, as your audience may know, Gillette. Venus, Presto, Barba, et cetera. So, so launching many products out there, learning and so, so many systems that can be able to help me also enable some of these solutions. Within, within Google today and outside of the professional side, of course, father, husband, they were enthusiastic as you can see on the background there.

Cory Connors: 3:11

I can't wait to show my son. Yeah, he's, yeah, he's, just put together an amazing Lego last night and, yeah, I'll show him this video. He'll be jealous. So great bonding,

Miguel Arevalo: 3:21

great

Cory Connors: 3:23

bonding Yeah, it's really what they have done is incredible. The Lego team for future engineers like yourself. you know, this is, it's incredible to learn how things go together and be able to do it yourself at different levels of your life, from young to older, like us, and it's an amazing thing, but it sounds like you've spent some time at some. big companies with some big resources and got to really learn how to innovate and lead the charge for sustainable packaging. tell us

Miguel Arevalo: 3:58

more about that. That's been a journey, to be honest with you. I think, let me maybe speak a little bit around, so these big companies at the end, they have the opportunity to make such big impacts and they are part of a. Every day lives for people. And of course, that means a great responsibility, such as father might be able to say, so definitely. We as designers, we embrace the challenge. You know, we need to be sure that the sustainability is our generation challenge and In words of our fearless leader here in Google, Ivy Ross, we need to, we, as a scientist, we need to make sure that we can double to enable that. So, yeah, no, I appreciate that,

Cory Connors: 4:38

Corey. Yeah, there's also some challenges, being part of a large, company, you can't do things small, you know, things like, I, I've spoken with a few companies about this, challenge of capacity. some of these innovations are, maybe not ready for scale yet. is that something that you've ran into where, gosh, we just can't, we can't get a million of these or we can't get 500, 000 of these yet?

Miguel Arevalo: 5:07

Yeah, let me maybe speak a little bit more, on what we have done here and how that maybe have translated on, on, on the last years that we work on it. So. You know, on these particular products, aesthetics is key. And we want to make sure our consumers validate their purchase decisions. They spend a lot of time making sure that they are making the right choice. They are putting the trust in different companies so they can be able to manage everything in their lives today. So if you're right now spending a couple of hundred dollars in order to have a phone, you are expecting everything to be perfect. Our budget today is, has been built around fibers, has been built around making sure that, we leverage constructions on sharp edges, we leverage constructions on clean cutouts, through perfection, thoughtfulness. So for years, we have been reducing volume and weight across generations. So, our pixel line, it has been there for, since 2016. And right now we, on our last fall, we went on our seventh iteration there. And through all that time, we have been leveraging molded fiber. We have been leveraging the construction of boxes. And as you mentioned, no, this scale is important. So we can be able to keep building that up in a way that is economically viable. So, let me back in 2020. We, we embraced challenge. We said that we, because at that point of time, even though our box was mainly done by fibers and papers, some plastic work here and there, and these plastics were required. So we can be able to be sure that we protect our box. So again, you can able to show this premiumness, this perfection on it. yeah. So, along this journey on the last three years, we have been, very passionate, these teams. I'm proud to say that this is, the best team I've been with, many professionals and they know what they do. And we decided that we wanted to maximize, the use of the circularity of the material by allowing plastic free solutions in our boxes. The reason why we decided to pass the paper to be the reason to move on this direction was because it's, it is a waste stream that is more evolved in a way, more mature across different regions. So we wanted to try to scale and enable these solutions all across as much as possible. Of course, remove headaches for recyclers that process it and making sure that we are looping valuable materials across the supply chain. So the challenge was, we needed to be sure that at the scale, we still maintain this perfection. We still maintain this thoughtfulness and, but we remove the plastics around it. And those were choices of materials that didn't exist. So, last fall, particularly this product, we were able to achieve 99% plastic free. Wow. So basically, Well done. We just had some little things there, but, it has been the catapult from us so we can be able to keep leveraging across our portfolio. And we are very excited for these fall product launches that we're going to have. and definitely this is going to be a good, a good point where we can keep also the industry moving forward like this

Cory Connors: 8:22

direction. And for those listening, Miguel is holding up, a Google Pixel, phone box and it's beautiful. It's, looks to be the, exactly the right size. It's as small as it can be made out of, incredible paper and, with beautiful print and, like you've mentioned, molded fiber inside to support and protect, very impressive packaging. Do you want to open it up to show? Of course.

Miguel Arevalo: 8:48

Thanks. And I think maybe just a, I think one of the things that I love since before, I mean, in the tech industry, it's these delay gratification where how the box is getting open in a way. I love that it has always been and how it being right now was close to the team and how they can be able to spec all these particular requirements and making sure that suppliers also kind of buy to that. I like that. Our team has been able, not what you can be able to see it there. We, has been able to go age to age as much as possible. So we can maximize the product actually ratio. they have done an amazing work through generations, which has translated them, these weight involved in productions. And the other at the end is making sure that the product is protected. Nevertheless, you will see a very thin lining here. This thing is as strong as a rock. It will not be able to have any issues when it's shipped. Anywhere in the world. But we think I was talking around the innovation, adding how sustainability and accessibility is also part of this journey. So our team along working closely with users, making sure that we have an inclusive experience. Not everyone has the opportunity to have both hands and being able to manipulate the box and challenges where you have these close edge to edge kind of solution, not everyone can be able to try to poke their finger in to take it out, or most likely have two hands. So you can be able to try to catch it. And since you're already spent a couple of hundreds of dollars there, they, what we decided is also to enable some accessibility solutions where you don't need to pinch, you don't need to try to fit it on, you don't need to. Roll it out. You could just use different solutions there. So any cost can customize those experiences. Either you have visual impairments, dexterity impairments. at the end, we are of these thoughtful experiences, making sure that anyone can be able to have an equitable experience and they can be able to remove all these different solutions in place.

Cory Connors: 10:49

Very intuitive, very easy to open, well done, incredible design. I love that delayed gratification that you said. We, well, I, what you're talking about for the people that couldn't see was, as you open a, a Google pixel, it takes a few seconds. And that is the, as we say at Aurora Packaging, the promise of what's inside. you're in, the anticipation is growing. Exactly. I love that. Well done. Very nice design. We,

Miguel Arevalo: 11:18

we're passionate and fortunate to have this amazing team working on

Cory Connors: 11:23

this. Yeah. I've been in, consumer of your Nest products, as you can see right above me here, there's one, yeah. And, we love how they all, sync together, including the cameras that we have outside and the doorbell and everything. It's incredible how it all works. But to be, very specific, we love the boxes that they came in. The packaging was just like, Whoa, they really put a lot of thought into these and, the design, the beauty of them. Even my kids were like, Whoa, what's that? I can't wait to open that. Exactly. Nice work. Oh, thank you. Thank you. So, I wanted to ask you a kind of a oddball question here. What I know this isn't really possible for a lot of what you provide. but what do you think of reusable packaging as a future?

Miguel Arevalo: 12:14

actually, I think I will not lie. so. I believe, reusable packaging has a solution there. one of the things that I wanted to look on at Circularity Excel when we met was, how much this has been evolved. and I am amazed to be honest with you, how packaging has been evolved through years. I don't know if you remember back in the day, I'm coming from Mexico, by the way. So back in the day, I remember when in my youth, To if I would like to have a coke in going to the store in the corner of the street, you needed to bring your own glass bottle. So you can be sure you cannot forget the latest and greatest. No, I mean, how that has been coming more and more a so I had the opportunity a on an event back in February, the global organization, they are doing amazing things around bringing inclusiveness around packaging and celebrating across many industries. and I was able to see Coca-Cola there, specifically Manir Rera. he has been leading the r and d patching, team there. and they were sharing around all, how to bring it back on these new world that we have today, leveraging everything, new technologies that we have. And they have been running several pilots back, there in Texas in order to try to see where it can scale. Oh yeah, ity. Security going back on what we saw in Seattle was an eye opening experience, to be honest with you. One, I think the first event, my main goal there was to see back end stuff. and we sent an army of different people within Google. and the first thing that was seen upstream is a startup on reusable systems, sharing everything that they have done and how. That the, this, the increase of a startup has gone 1, 100% on since 2019. That's been explosive has been massive on it. They believe reusable packaging has a path of electronics. We believe convenience is kink. Convenience and consumers demand not only thoughtful experience to open the box, but also on the responsible disposal. Of our management of the package used. So, reusable is a logistic challenge. It was something specifically for our products, since it has certain weight on it, you need to start accounting for carbon impacts. You wanted to make sure that whatever you ship, you're effective the way you ship it. But, but still, there is this, is something that we are actively looking at, specifically on, on how people, Evolve. Let's say, if I would like to change to my pixel seven, to pixel eight to pixel right, to whatever. people also want to make sure that the product that they used to have it, it brings some value on their new purchase. So we have seen that you can be able to bring back your product. It will be able to cash it out on, like an investment in a way No, but making sure that this product is going back to us and we can be able to. manage it responsibly, be able to remove the different materials that are being used, or not remove them by itself. We can be able to also put it in the market for someone else that is going to still find it valuable. So that, Gene, is going to, is key, and reusable systems can be able to help with that particular portion. Also, we see a trend on repairability. There has been so many requirements. IMEA has been leading the front on that particular scenario and consumers are demanding that they have the choice. In order to keep their products to be, to be active as much as possible. So, definitely to try to move not only the product itself, but tools going to the users or the product back. So companies that are able to fix them and send it back again, packaging can be able to play a role everywhere. Reusable could be a good system there. I think we just need to be sure that we define what success means, what we want to control and understand the trade. And making sure that it's something that is going to be valuable for the consumer and it will provide convenience and better benefits.

Cory Connors: 16:13

Yeah, really well said, Miguel. I think the Coke bottle from, Mexico is a perfect example of the way that we should look at packaging and, re, returning your cell phone, to, to resell it to Google is another perfect example of why you keep the box, for your pixel phone and then get a new one in a new box. And, you know, and then reuse that one when you send that one back. and then this not only is the item sustainable, but so is the packaging. It's just, it's a great circular system. And, I think it's so great to see companies like Google leading the charge there. Well done. I appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you. what's the future? what are you excited about? Is there a, a new innovation that you've seen that you're like, I like that. I could use that somehow. No,

Miguel Arevalo: 17:05

there's so many, I think, again, these shows, these trade shows, there are definitely a place where you can go to start picking up different things. And I think the beauty of packaging is you don't need to just have your mindset, only what technology. Technology companies are doing. There is so much that many companies are doing. In fact, you can allow these interconnections, you know, and one thing that I love about it is you don't need to be expert on everything. You need to be able to see where connections exist and be able to ask the right question. Challenge paradigms. So what I believe the future of stable packaging is less is more, I think at the end. Yes, packaging is needed, enabling systems that maximize the use of materials while protecting the products are going to be essential on this journey. Everyone is aiming to be zero carbon for many companies, different timings across 2030, 2040, 2050, some of them. And of course, different challenges are across because as today. Different system in order to try to move products across the trade, it requires, it has more challenges in some places rather than the others. But on the other side, there is no better package than the one that you don't need. So really making those connections and really understanding where refillable or reusable opportunities exist also will be key. On our side, when needed, a certified source of materials, making sure that whatever you are pulling your materials there. Are going to be able to harvest in and come back properly responsible disposed in the use of recycled materials maximize these closed loops on a on a circular economy are going to be essential reusable system. As I said, it's going to have a specific role and it will base on the needs. Outside of the physical realm itself, outside of the actual box in the structure, I think one thing that companies are considering are doing very well, some of them, but we need to keep considering this education, not only education for the consumers that we sell the product, but also education for policymakers, education for regulators. So really, actionable. An effective solutions for these very complex problem. and lastly, I think a partnership is essential forums like this one, making sure that different professionals, even though you are not seeing this particular, you are not on the sector. You can be able to hear about what is happening out there. We can be able to connect and hopefully at the end, I'm able to spark under your audience, maybe an email here and there, a LinkedIn message or whatever. That is going to be key because at the end, this is not going to be a problem that is going to be solved, but one Google by one proctor by it's going to be something that we all need to live together. And we need to understand the intricacies, the different things that needs to be able to

Cory Connors: 19:54

accelerate these needs. Very true. Well said. We all must work together. Packaging is nearly a trillion dollar business. And, I think, even though Google is a great big company, everyone needs to be a part of the solution. Everyone needs to consider, like you said, what's, where is this going to end up? is there recycling available for this? In that area, is there, a return system possible or, very true. Very well said, exciting stuff going on in this world. are you going to any shows coming up? Any, Pack Expo in Las Vegas? I

Miguel Arevalo: 20:31

definitely, I definitely have my eye on Pack Expo. Definitely. And I was working my, my. My registration there. And I, one of my college that I used to work in PNG, he, I think he's an Amazon right now making great stuff there back on Europe. He invited me on their sustainability summit on Amsterdam. I think he's going to be on November. Yeah, I'm putting my letter there so we can also try to.

Cory Connors: 20:53

I'll be there to be awesome. I'm speaking there. I'm so excited about it. Yeah. Tim Sykes from packaging Europe invited me and I said, Oh yes, I would love to. Hopefully we can see us there. That's awesome. Miguel, that'd be amazing. We'll look forward to that, sir. Well, thank you again. I appreciate your wisdom. It was fun to see all your, awesome Legos and thank you for showing us the pixel, packaging Google is doing great things in the world of sustainable packaging. Thank you. Thank you, Corey, for having me. And thank you, Orora Packaging Solutions, for sponsoring this podcast, and stay tuned for more.